Finding the Humor in Caregiving w/ Gov. Martin Schreiber

Summary:

In this episode of CareLab, hosts Emilia Bourland and Brandy Archie engage in a profound conversation with Martin J. Schreiber, the former Governor of Wisconsin and an advocate for Alzheimer's disease awareness. Schreiber shares his experiences as a caregiver to his wife, Elaine, who battled Alzheimer's. The discussion centers on the emotional challenges of caregiving, the importance of self-care for caregivers, and the power of joining the world of someone with dementia. Schreiber also emphasizes the value of humor and therapeutic fibbing in navigating the caregiving journey.

Key Takeaways:

• Joining the World of Dementia Patients: Emphasize the importance of entering the reality of a loved one with dementia, rather than trying to correct or argue with their perceptions.
• Therapeutic Fibbing: Using harmless lies to ease the emotional stress of dementia patients is not only acceptable but beneficial.
• Self-Care for Caregivers: Caregivers must prioritize their well-being to effectively care for their loved ones.
• The Power of Humor: Finding humor in daily life can help alleviate the stress and emotional toll of caregiving.
• Meaningful Connections Without Memory: Physical affection and being present can create meaningful connections, even when the person with dementia no longer recognizes their loved ones.

Transcript:

 Emilia Bourland
Hi everyone, welcome to Care Lab.

Brandy Archie
It's Care Lab Day. I'm so excited. We have an awesome guest today. And also it's just Friday, which makes it awesome. So yeah, welcome to Care Lab.

Emilia Bourland
Yeah, always best day. Carol Abse, always best day. And I am really excited today because we have a kind of extra special guest. Very, very, I need another word other than excited. So someone please in the comments if you have a thesaurus near you, which is a word that I can't say, please let me know. I'm excited. I'm stoked. This is going to be so awesome. Today we have with us former Wisconsin governor.

Martin J. Schreiber, who is a dedicated and outspoken advocate on Alzheimer's disease, dementia, and caregiving. He shares his experiences as a caregiver to his wife and high school sweetheart, Elaine. He speaks at events nationwide and he has a book called My Two Alanes, Learning, Coping, and Surviving as an Alzheimer's Caregiver. He's received widespread praise from the caregiving community.

He has extensive public service, which includes roles as the youngest member of the state Senate of Wisconsin, Lieutenant Governor of Wisconsin and the 39th governor of Wisconsin. Yes, y 'all, we have a governor on Care Lab today. Governor on Care Lab podcast. He's a native of Milwaukee and Marty and Elaine together have four children, 13 grandchildren and six great grandchildren.

Brandy Archie
Governor on the CareLab Podcast.

Emilia Bourland
Governor Schreiber, welcome to CareLab. We are so, so thrilled and humbled to have you here today.

Martin Schreiber
Well, I'm the one that's thrilled. I've received a lot of introductions in my time, but nothing as gracious and kind as what yours was. I hope we're one third as exciting and pleased with what's going on as the introduction. That always worries me. I'm going to have to figure out how I can sort of match your expectations. But an honor for me to be here with you, but also to take a moment to acknowledge with deep gratitude what you do to help make the lives of people better.

You and I both know and also your viewers know that caregiving is one of the toughest jobs in the world. And the fact that you help people get through all of that, you give them opportunity, you give them hope, you give them acknowledgement, understanding, support. Wow. It's my honor to be here. And so thank you for the privilege of being with you. Thank you very much.

Brandy Archie
Yeah.

Emilia Bourland
Wow, well, those were very kind words. hope that we live up to them here today and with every episode that we do here on CareLab. Before we get into the serious stuff, talking about you and Elaine and your journey together as a caregiver and your book, My Two Elanes, we always start with an icebreaker question. And so I wanted to pose a question to both of you today. And I am really interested to hear the answer.

Brandy Archie
I know, exactly.

Emilia Bourland
to this one. And because we're rude, Marty, we're going to make you go first in your answer. So, OK, so are you ready for the question?

Brandy Archie
Very.

Martin Schreiber
I'm ready.

Emilia Bourland
Okay, so the question is, what is the thing that has changed about you the most as you have, you know, grown throughout your life and gotten older?

Martin Schreiber
I'd say appreciation for life as it is.

My dad told me as a young boy that things may happen that we hate and we can yell and scream and even revolt, or we can step back and look at what is and focus on how we can make it better. And so going through this journey with Elaine those many, years, I think of life and I think about the simplest things that really can bring us joy.

just by being together and having an opportunity to share a special moment of a beautiful bird or a wonderful flower or a great walk or the singing of a song together, all of those things become so more meaningful.

Brandy Archie
Yeah, that's so important, I think. like, not just like for anybody who's caregiving or dealing with Alzheimer's, but just for all of us in general. And that's why my answer is kind of related. And so I know it probably feels like a cop out, like I'm copying. promise this was my answer before yours, Marty. But over the years, I think I have grown to appreciate what's happening right now more than striving for what's happening in the future.

or paying only attention to what happens in the future. Because I remember as a kid, it was always about the next thing. Next set of grades, the next graduation from the next thing, getting the next job. It's always like the next, next, next thing. And now I feel much more like I want to do those things, and there's always more to come, but appreciate what's happening in the moment too. Otherwise, you don't even get to create those memories. So yeah, that's the thing. I try to focus a little bit more on as I've gotten older. Amelia, what about you?

Martin Schreiber
Yeah, thank you. Just let me interrupt. There's a phrase that says, ain't no fun arriving if it ain't no fun getting there. And I think what you pointed out was just exactly that, just to take the moments as we live them. Thank you.

Emilia Bourland
So I think...

Brandy Archie
Exactly.

Emilia Bourland
Well, those are both tough answers to follow. But okay, so I think that probably what's changed the most for me is that as I've gotten older, I've gotten so much more willing to ask for help and to say, I don't know. And those things were both so hard for me for like really a lot of my life to say, I don't know, you know, to realize that I didn't have to be

the expert or to know everything about everything. And just to simply ask for help, to realize that I couldn't do everything on my own and that that was totally okay. And that life is so much better when we do have help and we work as teams and partners and communities. And I think that for me, like when I made that transition in my own mindset and in my life, it was just such a great weight lifted off of my shoulders.

to think that like, thank goodness. I don't actually have to be responsible for all this. I can get help from other people when I need it. And I think that's been like the most life -changing change for me so far. But you know, isn't the fun thing about life that we never really stay the same, right? Like we think of ourselves as these static creatures, like that we've arrived and this is where we are and this is where we're always gonna be, but like nothing could be further from the truth, right?

Brandy Archie
Yeah.

Brandy Archie
Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

Martin Schreiber
You know, when you mentioned asking for help, with the many caregivers that I have had a chance to meet with, your message is so very, important. Men particularly don't want to ask for help, and they think it's some kind of bravado to do it on their own. And I think what you're saying when you ask for help, what it really means is you're not giving up. I have seen, you know, particularly male caregivers

who are so distraught and by God, they're gonna beat this disease and by God, they're gonna take care of themselves and they made this marriage promise and so forth. Well, the fact of the matter is if we are surrounded by an enemy and there is absolutely no way of us getting out other than to go for help, to not go for help means you're giving up. To go for help means you are showing courage, you are showing intelligence, you are showing bravery.

And so if we can help more caregivers understand just what you said, the life -changing experience when you have the courage and the intellect, the knowledge, the understanding to ask for help, the decency, really it's the decency to ask for help. Because what happens is, know, when you don't ask for help and you try and do it yourself, you get worn down and you become...

Brandy Archie
Yeah.

Martin Schreiber
you become maybe useless to your loved one, but yet sometimes useless to yourself or to your children or to your grandchildren. So anyway, anyway, great. Good to be with wonderful people.

Brandy Archie
think on that topic too, go.

Emilia Bourland
No, no, go ahead, go ahead.

Brandy Archie
I was just going to say like, you know, the, you look at it from a overarching view over the whole country, the numbers say that the majority of caregivers tend to be women because women live longer than men and because it's the female children that end up taking care of their parents more often than other times. And so think it's really interesting that you brought up the fact about like specifically men being caregivers and having sometimes a barrier to asking for help and maybe getting worn down more.

Do you mind telling us a little bit more about, I mean, you've not been a woman, I'm guessing, so you can't really compare it, but like how you've experienced that from your perspective and then also the other men that you've engaged with as being caregivers and like why it feels meaningful and important.

Emilia Bourland
Yeah.

Martin Schreiber
Well, you know, I sit here and I think one of the things that comes into play regarding asking is asking for help. And that is we cannot beat this Alzheimer's disease head on.

22 years ago when Elaine was first diagnosed, there was no cure. can't be prevented. Today, by the way, would be her 85th birthday if still alive. Today, Alzheimer's still cannot be cured or prevented. Yeah. And so because it cannot be cured or prevented, we know we can't take this disease head on. But what can we do? What is realizable? Well, what we can do, what is realizable is help our loved one live their best life possible.

Brandy Archie
Today?

Martin Schreiber
and how do we help them live their best life possible? One of the ways is as caregivers to keep ourselves healthy, to make sure that we don't develop irrational irritability, to make sure that we keep ourselves strong and don't get sick ourselves. And so that's where asking for help comes in, to know that...

Brandy Archie
Mm

Martin Schreiber
Our goal, our realizable goal under the current circumstances, the only realizable goal is to help our loved ones live their best life possible. And we can help do that by making sure that we take care of ourselves, but also by asking for help, we help take care of ourselves as well as our loved one live their best life possible.

Emilia Bourland
Yeah, one of the things and I think I knew Brandy that you were going to say that you were already going to go down the same road that I was going to go down for. But one of the things that I kind of want to, you know, really praise about you writing your story and sharing your story so widely and of course, know, Elaine's story as well, because it's really both of your story. You did it together. Is I.

love that you're doing that as a man because I think there are way more male caregivers out there in the world than we know and we acknowledge. And they deserve to be acknowledged just as much as any female caregiver out there deserves to be acknowledged and understood. And that journey, think because of the way that society thinks of care and caregiving and just the different gender roles that we've traditionally assigned to people, I think that that journey probably

does look and feel different for a man. And I could see, know, obviously I'm not a man. I can't have that kind of personal insight to it. But I can see how that journey would be different for a man based on the kinds of like expectations that we have in our culture of what it means to be a man, right?

Martin Schreiber
Well, if you remember, as we were getting ready for the broadcast discussion, we were talking about the fact that my mother taught me how to iron my trousers when I was like eight or nine years old. Well, I carried that with me. And also what I also saw my mother doing was taking care of my brother and sister when they got sick.

of helping them out. I never was involved in that. And, you know, in my era growing up, was always Elaine would be the main caretaker for the kids and so forth. And, well, finally, that's changing where men are getting more involved in that. But you are correct. It is that culture that keeps men more disabled, so to speak, from taking care of their loved one.

And that's really a shame. But, and I think that's what makes it difficult for men because they sort of have to relearn their life. I was going to say relearn their gender, but I don't know if that's quite as accurate, but we have to relearn our life to be able to do the kinds of things that women have been doing for so many years and taking care of people. So, you know, that's really...

I should mention, and you may be aware, I'm sure you're aware of this, but 30 % of caregivers allegedly die before their loved one. And that statistic comes about because the difficulty of caregiving and also because

Brandy Archie
Hmm.

Martin Schreiber
the emotional, you know, and then also the unanticipated grieving and the worry and the concern and the inability, well, not the inability, but the, if I excuse the word, stupidity of a caregiver not taking care of their own self, that's what causes these early deaths.

Brandy Archie
Yeah, and that's hard too because like the reason people are working themselves to the bone because they care so much for the person and it's similar to what you were saying earlier. It's like not putting up the not asking for help and not taking care of yourself is actually giving up as opposed to well, I think we package it is when we think about it's like, I'm working hard to the bone. This demonstrates my love and care for my person. But how good is that if you're not here to help them, right?

and probably haven't come up with a plan to find someone to be their helper when you're not here, right? Because you don't expect that to happen. You're the one providing the care. And so tell me a little bit, tell us a little bit about like why you felt it was important to talk about caregiving and tell you and Elaine's story in the form of a book.

Martin Schreiber
Well, first of all, to just piggyback on what you said about the caregiver taking care of themselves. My children actually had an intervention. They sat me down and they said, dad, you're going to be dead before mom if you don't take care of yourself. so that really was an important experience for me to go through because I, as you said, you try and do your best to help your loved one.

And no matter how hard you work because the disease is regressive, it gets worse the next day. And you think you just mastered it yesterday and everything is beyond gduri. And now all of a sudden, your loved one has regressed and now you have to do the same thing over. And so what did I do wrong? What could I be doing better? If I put in six hours, eight hours is going to be better. If I put in eight hours, 10 hours is going to be better, so forth and so forth. And then the gradual deterioration of the caregiver.

That leads us into the question of why I wrote the book. What happened was I found out, discovered that if there's one thing worse than Alzheimer's, it's ignorance of the disease and ignorance of the disease by the medical profession, by caregivers themselves, ignorance of the disease by communities, by churches, by synagogues, by parishes, ignorance of the disease. it's just...

Brandy Archie
Mm.

Martin Schreiber
There's just so much misunderstanding of that. And so when Elaine was first diagnosed, I had no idea that one of the best things and most important things I could do.

was to join Elaine's world. Because as long as I argued with her about it didn't happen on a Saturday, it happened on a Sunday, it wasn't the Smiths, it was the Joneses. Why did you put the car keys in the dishwasher? Why are you asking me the same questions over again and so forth? And so because I was ignorant, know, the Evanes world was so much more challenged because of me being an irritant, criticizing, asking questions, why are you doing this?

world was very very frustrating and so finally by understanding the idea of learning to let go of the person who once was so we can embrace this person who now is. So I saw that but then also I had a friend whose whose wife had dementia.

And he would argue with her and say, you can't have another blanket. I just gave you another blanket. You can't have another cookie. I told you. And so forth. And I saw that as I better understood this disease, how harmful that is. And I said, wait a minute. said, it would be like if I would have walked a very arduous, difficult trail. And now I'm sitting at the beginning of the trail. I've completed it. And now someone else is going on this trail and this journey.

I wanted to say, look, please sit down for a moment. Just sit next to me and just listen. Just let me share with you a little bit about what I have learned. How important therapeutic fiddliness, for example, how important it is to join the world of the person who now is, how important it is for you to take care of yourself. That's why I wrote the book. I did not want to have other people experience the misery that my wife and I experienced because I was so ignorant of the disease.

Martin Schreiber
I hope it helps. It's my two lanes, helping caregivers learn, cope, and survive. And maybe even adding on, thrive even. But that's just more of a challenge, isn't it?

Emilia Bourland
I really like how you phrase it as joining her world. When I'm teaching about caring for people with dementia, I'll often refer to it as just being in the moment with that person wherever they are. I think that the way you phrase it is better, honestly, just joining that person's world. Because the fact is, we can't argue with their reality. You can't argue with anyone else's reality.

The way that someone experiences the world is their experience of the world. And the more we rail against that, the more everyone digs their heels in and the more both people are miserable. think kind of going back to that idea of caregivers taking care of themselves, when we as caregivers of people with dementia allow ourselves to join that person's world,

and be in that moment with them, it's a great sense of relief and relaxation and a better experience for both people involved. That's what I have seen and what I have experienced is that similar to what your experience was too when you did join Elaine in her world.

Martin Schreiber
Absolutely. But while you're talking, what comes to my mind, I did a Barnes and Noble book presentation and we had a discussion and a lady stood up. Her name was Linda. She was like in her mid forties. And she said, you know, she said, my dad has Alzheimer's. And she says, one day I'm at work and my, get a call from my mother, say, come home quick. Dad's really asking strange. He's really acting very strange. Come home quick.

Well, she said she rushed home and when she walked into her parents' home, she walked and here her dad was in the living room and he was going like this.

And what he was doing is in his mind, was, you know, she walked to say, dad, what are you doing? Well, he says, I'm fishing, you know, what she says, can I fish with you? And he says, sure. She went on to point out that that experience, even what they were doing in the living room, acting like they were fishing. That was one of the best experiences she had had with her dad over the course of a long period of time. Well, now what happens is the episode is over.

Emilia Bourland
Yeah.

Martin Schreiber
And what is happening is that she's in the process of leaving. Her mother says, what do we ever do if this happens again? And she said, mom, get in the boat with dad. And that really hit home for me in understanding what you said. And that is about, about joining the world of the person who now is. And poor caregivers, however, what adds to the challenge in order to join the world of the person who now is, we have to let go of the person who once was.

my gosh, you know, we all know how hard, how very, very difficult that is. But by the same token, let me just mention one thing about, about joining their world. Elaine asked me once, how are my parents? And I said, well, they're both dead. Well, the shock on her face when she realized she didn't say goodbye, much less attend the funeral. I promised myself I'd never going to put her through that again. And so then.

Brandy Archie
Yeah.

Martin Schreiber
What happened that next time she asked me, are my parents? I said, Elaine, said, your mom is doing great. I said, she likes working at church. Your dad likes his sports. And she said that makes me feel so happy. So, well, that's what I call therapeutic fibbing, therapeutic fibbing. There's two things about therapeutic fibbing you should know. One of them is I tried it the first year of marriage. It didn't work so good.

Emilia Bourland
No, it tends not to that early on.

Brandy Archie
It didn't work.

Martin Schreiber
That's

Martin Schreiber
Well, and the second thing about therapeutic fibbing and not everyone believes me on this. want to confess and tell you not everyone believes me on this, but I was there actually at Mount Sinai when Moses went up to the mountain and he brought down the Ten Commandments. I helped him. I helped him bring down those tablets. And in the front of the tablets in Arabic, yes.

Brandy Archie
How did you?

Emilia Bourland
That was Marty. Yeah. I'm sorry. Go ahead. This is so wonderful. I could listen to you talk forever.

Martin Schreiber
Well, I just want to tell you what's going on. By the way, if you're ever with Moses, don't call him Mo. He hates it. And so anyway, so I helped Moses carry down those commandments. And the front, as I said, is Arabic Hebrew on the first two tablets. And that made no sense to me. But then I looked behind the tablets and here written in good American English, therapeutic bibbing is good. Therapeutic bibbing is advisable. Therapeutic bibbing can make life better.

And so people who are worried about telling a lie to people with dementia don't have to worry about that because it's very clear in the Ten Commandments that therapeutic is good, advisable, helpful, life -changing.

Brandy Archie
Yes. Yep.

It's like the idea that as adults, we feel like if I can just educate or make it fun or do something like that, I can rationalize with someone to get them to believe what I believe or think what I think or whatever, right? This is like a fundamental principle that we all use, right? It's to try to convince people to do things. And, but we don't do that with children, right? Like we don't try to convince them that they need to do X, Y, Z. We do lots of other things.

to be a part of their world and we do that because we know that their brains aren't as developed as ours are and they live in a different kind of experience as kids. And so we just accept that. And then as they get older, we give them more as they can handle because that's a progressive process. And then if we could switch our mind frame, which is so hard to do because your person is your person. That's just why the title of your book is so, I think, telling.

Emilia Bourland
Mm -hmm.

Brandy Archie
because Elaine, you're two Elaine's, right? And like, I don't want to speak for you as to why you called it that, but I immediately recognized this because we took care of my grandmother, my mother's mother, as she had Alzheimer's. And I knew her before that. And then when she was living with us, and as it regressed, she was not the same grandmother that I had before, right? And so it takes a lot to accept that. And then when you do accept that, then you can say to yourself, therapeutic sipping is okay.

Because we're not trying to get to a place of understanding. We're trying to have, be a part of their world and have a comfortable existence now until whenever, right? And so like, that's what the goal is. The goal is not to raise a kid who's really smart and engaged in economics so they need to know the right things. Your goal is to enjoy the life that you have right now. And so that's why the 11th commandment works out.

Emilia Bourland
Yeah, I am wholeheartedly in support of that 11th commandment. I think that's one of the best stories I've ever heard. I'm definitely going to share this idea of therapeutic fibbing because you're right. And that is kind of one of the main ways that we can join in to another person's world and really be able to enjoy that moment with them. think that and I would never in any way diminish the

Brandy Archie
You

Emilia Bourland
devastation that can come along with dementia and the grief that is involved with dementia diagnosis and caring for someone with dementia and also for the person who is personally themselves going through that journey with dementia. I would never ever diminish that. But I do think that what you're sharing here in your story and in all of this, like all these wisdom bombs that you're dropping on us here is that

There are opportunities for beauty and real meaningful connection with this person that you love, even though it might not be the same as it was before. But these opportunities, if we join them there in these moments and we go fishing with our dads, if we get in the boat, what a wonderful story that was. There are really such wonderful opportunities for joy and beauty.

Brandy Archie
Mm

Emilia Bourland
and meaningful connection in those moments. And we all can take away really wonderful, wonderful memories from those experiences.

Martin Schreiber
When you talk about meaningful connection, in this, I try and share with caregivers and also their families. I would go for, Elaine was in assisted living memory care for numbers of years. And so I was having lunch with her one day and she started to cry. And I say, Elaine, why are you crying? Well, she looked at me and she says, I'm beginning to love you more than my husband. Well.

I didn't ask her what's wrong with your turkey husband. I didn't do that. But here is what this meant to me as it relates to your point on meaningful connection. I learned that it is not necessary for her to know my name in order for our hearts to touch. And I have seen how devastating it is in people's minds when their loved one can no longer remember their name.

Brandy Archie
Mm.

Martin Schreiber
whether it's the caregiver or children or grandchildren, just that, my God, they can't remember my name and so forth. Well, that's okay because you're looking at hearts touching and hearts can touch by holding a hand, by giving a hug, by singing songs together, by just being with one another, by sitting and watching the leaves roll across the lawn. All of that is so important to happen. And so,

What also happens then is, I'm not going to go see so -and -so because I'm not going to visit them because they don't know who I am anyway. Well, that's not true. It could be they don't know your name, but it doesn't mean your heart still can't touch. And that then becomes so meaningful, giving of comfort. Again, our goal is to help our loved one live their best life possible. And this wonderful authorist said,

I never remember what you said. I may never remember what you did, but I will always remember how you made me feel. And I want people to know that just because they don't know your name, don't become disheartened because you still have that opportunity for hearts to touch.

Emilia Bourland
I think that one of the things that people are sometimes discouraged by or friends or family who aren't maybe the direct immediate caregiver for someone will sometimes stop going to see that person who has dementia because they just don't know what to say. They're afraid of trying to have a conversation with that person. And I think we can all relate to that. We've had some experience like that, right, where we just weren't sure what to say.

I bet that you have some wonderful advice and thoughts to give to folks who are maybe listening to this and thinking, well, I haven't seen Aunt Judy in a long time, I'm just not sure what to say. I don't even know how to approach that situation. What would you tell someone who is having that kind of anxiety?

Martin Schreiber
Well, I'm going to sort of back into it to the answer. Alzheimer's is not what you call a chicken casserole disease. If hypothetically speaking, I have open heart surgery, people bring me a chicken casserole recuperating. If I fall and break a hip, people bring me chicken casserole recuperating. If my wife has Alzheimer's because people are ignorant of this disease,

Brandy Archie
Yeah.

Martin Schreiber
They don't know what to say, they don't know what to do, and so they stay away. And because they stay away, then the caregiver not only is trying to deal with the loss of their loved one as their mind disappears daily, but they're also feeling abandoned and neglected because friends of 25, 30 years, 40 years are no longer coming by. And so...

One of the best ways to handle all of this is to understand if Alzheimer's is bad, ignorance of the disease is worse, to share with friends what this Alzheimer's is about and to have them understand that this is a situation where they may not know your name and they may come up with other ideas, you still can bring them as a good friend the kind of comfort

of making them feel as if your hearts are touching. so, yes, but I have to also go to this point. Everyone handles grief a different way. So Elaine had two sisters and a brother, and some of them came and some of them never came. And it gets to the point where I...

I have to learn that it is not my role, my job to tell someone how to handle grief. And so if someone is truly grieving and they can't really handle the visitation, I have to understand and accept that. But by the same token, not everyone is that way. And if we can help our friends, our neighbors, our relatives, siblings and so forth, better understand this disease and have them know

that even though they don't know our name, they still will feel refreshed and comforted by the fact that there is that kind of visitation, that kind of getting together.

Brandy Archie
Are there some ways that you either had people that participated in your lives together or would have been helpful to you to kind of give people some concrete examples about ways that they can be a part of, continue to be a part of somebody's life even if they do have Alzheimer's?

Martin Schreiber
Well, had a niece, I have a niece, but anyway, she knew when I would be there with Elaine at lunchtime and she would stop by and bring flowers. Well, Elaine would get the sense of the flowers and so forth. I would get the comfort of being acknowledged as a caregiver. I was comforted as being acknowledged as someone who was going through some really tough challenges. And so that's an example of

of someone bringing, know, being with you at the time of just being visiting with your loved one. And my brother Bob and his wife Rose, they were just truly outstanding too in the fact that they were willing to, you know, be with me and understand and to listen to what I was going through. If people can understand that by visiting,

they're not only helping the person who is ill, but they're also helping the caregiver. You know, my brother would want to help out his brother. I would want to help out my brother, my sister, and so forth. And so to know that just because you don't want to go visit the person who is ill doesn't mean you still cannot visit the caregiver and be with them at the time they're with their loved one to make

you know, some kind of a more comforting experience for them. But that is what comes to my mind at the moment.

Emilia Bourland
One of the things that I'm seeing that you, I think, have a really unique talent for, in addition to, know, obviously you're incredibly intelligent, you're very empathetic, you're a wonderful communicator, but I also think you're really good at finding the humor in things. Can you talk a little bit about ways that you were able to find...

kind of humor in your journey, even though sometimes it was hard and how people can find humor in their own days, even when maybe they're having a tough day caring for someone they love.

Martin Schreiber
Well, first of all, thank you for all the compliments. I wish I could halfway measure up to what you're trying to describe. So thank you for that. Well, this humor, we need humor. And when I visit with people and when I have my book discussions, it seems like almost caregivers have to have an excuse to laugh. It seems that caregivers, we're so uptight.

rightly so with what is going on in our lives. We're involved in the emotional loss and now we're wondering what's going to happen after my loved one dies. How long will my loved one be alive? Surviving? What kind of food can I have? Will I have enough money? And so all of that is going on. But then if we can get some kind of moment momentarily of a laugh. Like I said, when Elaine said she's loving

me more than her husband and like I didn't ask what's wrong with your turkey husband, you know, that to me sort of struck me sort of funny and I had a chance to repeat that to friends and so on and to just look for opportunities. So I sometimes tell the story about how I'm with Elaine at lunch and she gets on this tangent where she...

it's telling me and everybody around how intelligent and how good looking I am. And so I tell people, you know, well, what happened was that there was a doctor and a nurse at a nearby table and they heard Elaine tell everybody and tell me how intelligent and how good looking I am. And they said, Elaine is getting better because she knows her husband is intelligent and good looking. And then I go on to point out that they wrote an article for the New England Medical Journal and they

The New England Medical Journal, not being dumb, is they wrote back and they said, you have to show three things where someone is getting better. You only show two, intelligent and good looking. so, then, so a period of time went by and now Elaine and I are having lunch again. And now she get on one of these tangents. How did we meet? How did we meet? I said, Elaine, when we were freshmen in high school, we sat next to each other in Latin class and I fell in love with you right away. And I said,

Martin Schreiber
I knew I wanted you for my wife. I knew that you are so beautiful and kind and so forth. And I said, not only that, I said that if any boy got within 50 feet of you, I popped him on the head. Well, she looked at me and she said, you're a bullshitter. Well, now they have the three things, okay? And so you can look for a New England Medical Journal article around October, November, where they say Elaine Schreiber had gotten better because she knew her husband.

had these three attributes. but humor ends up becoming so important. I try to incorporate that as much as I can. One, sharing a situation with you, I point out that this disease takes us to places we never thought we would be. Did I ever think I would be able to be on

on a show as quality of what you have and to be talking with people like I am talking with you and so forth. Never, never. And so I use the example of I was elected to the state Senate back in 1962 and I was a member of the state Senate Education Committee. Well, one of my job responsibilities was to go to Washington, DC for a meeting. And if you take a 530 in the morning airplane out of Milwaukee and

you can go to Washington, D .C. every meeting and come back the same day, which I was in the process of doing. And so it's five o 'clock in the morning and we're boarding the airplane. this is going to make sense as you look at the geography of the United States. If you take off in Milwaukee, you're going to fly over Detroit and so forth. anyway, so this and then almost a straight line between Milwaukee, Detroit. But anyway, so this gentleman is ahead of me getting on the airplane in Milwaukee. And he said,

Does this plane stop in Detroit? Does it fly over Tennessee? Yes, it does, Well, he says, I have to get off in Detroit. She's fine. No, he said, I have to get off in Detroit because I've got an appointment. She says, yes, sir. No, he says, look at it. I'm inclined to fall asleep. If I fall asleep, I'm going to miss getting off, and I'm going to miss a very important meeting. Will you get me off? Yes. Do you promise you will get? Sir, I promise I'll get you off of this airplane in Detroit.

Martin Schreiber
Well, now we land in Washington, D .C. And this gentleman, then distinguished as he was and so forth, as he gets off of the airplane in Washington, D .C., he berates the flight attendant like I've never seen anyone berated before in my whole life. I felt sorry for the flight attendant. And after he had left, I walked up to her and I said, my gosh, I said that man was angry. He was so, so angry. And she said, he was angry. You should have seen the fellow I put off in Detroit.

Martin Schreiber
So anyway, so it's humor. It's trying, it's an open, I think it's an opening of the heart, a refreshment of the existence, just to have that kind of a, I don't know, the soothing kind of effect. And I try as much as possible as I visit to give people an excuse to laugh and to try and have as quality of life as they can have too.

Emilia Bourland
Ha ha!

Brandy Archie
Well, Marty, we really appreciate you covering our Care Lab and sharing your story. Where can people find the book at so that they can read it for themselves?

Martin Schreiber
Well, first of all, thanks for asking. We have a website, my2elanes, all one word, my2elanes .com. And so that would be one of the places, but I know that our area, Barnes and Noble has them, and I don't know, I think probably through Amazon and so forth. And then also please let everyone know that this is a mission for me. And if anyone needs or would like a talk, a visitor, I don't charge.

I ask maybe that they buy a couple books, but I don't charge. And if there would happen to be a situation where there is a profit from the sale of books, goes to caregiver support groups and so on. But mytuilanes .com that also has sort of the schedule of where I'm supposed to be next thing, scheduled to be down in Mississippi for a bit up in Minneapolis for a bit and so forth.

No, I'm glad I would be so honored to share my book. One thing that I want you to know about the book is that I wrote the book and I thought I had told my story and lo and behold, maybe three weeks before going to print, I find a series of notes and journals and diaries that Elaine had been keeping since her diagnosis. I went through those notes and diaries with my two daughters, Kathy and Christine, and we

picked out notes from her diary that I use to begin each chapter with. And what that does is when the reader looks at that, they get a firsthand insight into what goes on in the mind of a person who is diagnosed with this disease and has to continue forward. And I think if people read that, they're going to get a much

greater understanding as to how important they are in their loved one's life. And also a better understanding how important it is to join their world. And that's just by the notes in front of each chapter. And so it's been a wonderful thing to be able to think that I was able, am able to help people along on this journey. And it means the world to me and it means the world to me that I could be on.

Martin Schreiber
your program with you and to share this kind of discussion. It's just outstanding. Thank you.

Emilia Bourland
Governor Martin Treiber, thank you so much for being here. Y 'all, if you are looking for his book, My Two Elanes, or you wanna know more about where he's speaking, the link to mytwoelanes .com is going to be included in the show notes for this episode. So you can just look down there and you can click right on that link and find it straight from there. If you enjoyed this episode, if you made it all to the end and I hope that you did.

then please make sure that you are liking subscribing. Please leave a review and a comment. That is one of the ways that it makes it easier for other caregivers to find CareLab and get access to the information and resources that we share. Thank you so much for listening. Governor Schreiber, thank you so much for being here. We really, really appreciate you and we will see you all or hear you all next time right here on CareLab.

Brandy Archie
Bye.

 

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